Moving up in limits

[Invigilator]

Not so much of an issue of comfort. I was just wondering about applying that 20 buy-in idea for proper BR management. If you don't treat it like a hard and ABSOLUTE rule, then what.

hmmm. Wait a sec. When I say it that way, comfort is definitely an issue.

Granted, In think the Q still stands. If I have built up to $1000 in order to play 50 max, how far below $1000 should I allow myself to be spanked down before I revert to 25 max (in general).

[Talking Poker]

This thread has gone from semi-strange to well.... I don't know what.

Bankroll management has been discusses here dozens of times - hit the search box if you are looking for more.

But I will add:

Sitting with a short stack while learning and trying to improve your basic game (as opposed to a short stack specific approach which would be completely pointless at micro limits anyway) is a bad idea. Sit with a freaking full stack - or move down. I guess the exception to this would be when you are already playing the lowest limits available and can't move any lower. My advice then would be to stop playing, read some books, do your homework, whatever, until you are comfortable playing with a full buy in. Whatever you do, DO NOT move up until you are playing the current level with a full buy in. Don't even think about it.

And yeah, Ando (not to single you out, dude, but I completely disagree with what Invigilator said about you) claims his short stack strategy works, but from what I've seen, I don't believe it. I suspect any success he has had playing like this would be from short term variance more than anything else.

As for when to move back down after moving up, I'm not sure why this is even a question:

If you have $900, that's 18 buy ins at $50, right? So, if your limit is 20, you're below your limit, so move down. To avoid immediately having to move down if you take one beat after moving up, wait to move up until you have 25 buy ins and then move back down when you get to 20 (for example). Simple. If you insist on moving up when you get to exactly 20, move back down when you drop to 18. But FFS, don't sit there and blow your entire roll after things are going south, just because you WERE rolled for a game! That's the whole point of bankroll management and this 20x buy in guideline.

[BlibbityBlabbity]

Right, so if you move up when you hit the exact $ amount that you need for the next level and then lose your first hand (or have a bad first session), do you move down?

I would say take a shot at it for maybe 1/4 of the roll (assuming the previous limit was about 1/2 the requirement) and then if you are down 75% move back down and rebuild and then try again. That way you aren't knocking yourself down too far at the higher limit and having to start over at the previous level.

[Talking Poker]

If you do this, you're really making the limit 15 buy ins, which I think is a bad idea.

Think of it as "At what level should I move down in stakes?" and the answer as "When you have less than 20 buy ins" and maybe this will make more sense to you guys.

That's a more conservative way to look at it, of course, but I think it's better. Instead of sitting out of your lower level games and hurrying to move up the minute you hit 20 buys ins, maybe take your time and let yourself get up to 21 or 22...

[BlibbityBlabbity]

I agree with the waiting till you have more than 20 BIs to move up. I would say 25 -30 is more like it if you are going to be moving down at 20BI. There has to be enough play to evaluate the new level or why bother (you are just hoping to get lucky and putting too much pressure to win on your first session or two at the new limit).

Wasn't it the standard advise in the past to play 5000+ hands at the new limit? No way to do that with only 1-2 buyins buffer before moving down.

If it was me, I would probably stick to 30BIs to move up and drop back down at 20 to rebuild if necessary.

Looking at it assuming you are set on moving up at 20BIs, I think the moving back down to rebuild at 15 is reasonable (although not ideal). You don't risk going broke, but you do risk having to spend more time rebuilding, where the more conservative approach gives you some protection against having to move down at all.

[Invigilator]

Thanks guys. The whole buffer/threshold thing was what was on my mind and you clarified a lot of the ideas I was mulling over.